The “STINK”
Why EPI dogs “stink” after starting powdered pancreatic enzymes?
The stench is part putrefaction “the process of decay or rotting in a body or other organic matter.” In layman’s terms, think of it this way, up until now, a lot of the food the dog ate was not being properly digested, backed up with undigested food particles… fermented….. now enzymes are digesting the nutrients, and it is also consequently “shaking loose” all that accumulated nasty fermented undigested food particles (SID)…. that is one part of why you smell something foul. The other part of the foul smell is that the researchers found in EPI dogs that there are increased blood levels of putrescine and spermidine (see https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fnut.2019.00016/full) are well-known foul-smelling molecules, and so changes in these “polyamine” molecules may account for the smell observed in some EPI patients when you give them enzyme supplements.
Why do EPI dogs no longer stink or stink less when using enteric coated enzymes vs. powdered enzymes?
We don’t really know why, but the only difference between these two types of enzymes is that with enteric coated enzymes, a much lesser amount of enzymes are used to treat EPI so this may have something to do with why
the dog doesn’t stink or stinks less then when using powdered enzymes.
“A dysbiotic microbiota can compromise the gut barrier, resulting in tissues and organs being flooded with molecules from the diet
and microbiota that can negatively impact the host immune system and metabolism.”
May 2024 ENZYME Survey – 372 EPI Pet Owners interviewed:
We surveyed 372 EPI pet owners. We did this survey because in the past year or so, we started hearing complaints with giving enzymes based on the weight of the dog, as instructed by their vet. The complaints we are hearing are: dogs won’t eat the food with so much enzymes (med/lg dogs), diarrhea, too much math to recalculate when weight changes and it’s too expensive. In this survey, we also included some questions on enteric coated enzymes to assess if enteric coated enzymes might help reduce that EPI “stink” that some owners notice around the dog’s mouth or head. Here are the results:
- 0ut of 372 pet owners surveyed, 87.9% give enzymes according to the volume of food, 12.1% give enzymes according to the weight of the dog.
2. Poop condition with enzyme given via food volume: 85% poop is mostly normal, 12.9% mixed results, 2.1% mostly soft or loose stools.
3. Poop condition with enzymes given via dog’s weight: 80% poop is mostly normal, 15.6% mixed results, 4.4% mostly soft or loose stools
4. Out of 372 pet owners surveyed, only 5.7% give enteric coated enzymes, 94.3% do not give enteric coated enzymes
5. Did switching to enteric coated enzymes help improve the “stink”? 57.1% said YES!!!, 38.1% did not notice, 4.8% said No.
6. If your dog has always been on enteric coated enzymes have you noticed a body/mouth odor? 76.2% said No smell, 14.3% did not notice a smell, 9.5% noticed somewhat of a smell.
For more in-depth details about the “stink”, an “EPI Odor” study was done in 2013 with 412 participants. (See actual results from the 2013 study further below on this page) … BUT the important takeaway details from 2013 that relate to the 2024 survey are as follows:
- Out of the 412 participants, 95% (386) used powdered enzymes.
- Out of the 95% on powdered enzymes 62% that said their dog had an odor
- Out of the 62% that had an odor, 56% claimed that the odor never went away no matter what they tried.
QUESTIONS ASKED IN THE 2024 CURRENT ENZYME STUDY:
These numbers reflect the participation of 412 EPI companion animals…. 405 dogs and 7 cats
What enzymes did you start on? What enzymes are you using now?
EnzymeDiane 8x 27 107
EnzymeDiane 6x 69 153
Other 44 2
Pancrezyme 86 33
Viokase 65 17
PanaKare Plus 29 9
Pancrex V 18 6
EPI Pro8 0 8
EPI Pro6 10 17
CREON 10/12 5 13
CREON 24/25 11 4
Lypex 6 3
Partnar Health 14 12
Pancrea Tab Plus 5 2
Raw Pancreas 2 4
Tryplase 3 2
BioCase V 10 6
Chemeyes 1 5
Panzyme 5 7
EpiZyme 2 2
When the enzymes were implemented…. was there an odor???
YES = 254
No = 158
What is the approximate amount of enzymes given per cup of food?
Less than 1/2 teaspoon = 40
1/2 teaspoon = 110
1 teaspoon = 212
2 teaspoons = 19
1-3 tablets = 28
3+ tablets = 1
7/+ tablets = 1
3 ounces Raw Pancreas = 1
and now the nitty gritty of the survey…..
What did the odor smell like ??????????????????
Cooked Cabbage 17
Vinegar 10
Sour Milk 69
Cat Pee 33
Other 81
Rotten Eggs 21
Feces 23
How long after the enzyme supplementation was started did the odor persist (237 responded to this question) ?
A few days 25
A couple of weeks 24
A few months 33
A year 8
More than a year 14
Odor never went away 133
Where around the dog or cat was the odor apparent ? Select ALL that applies. (there were 348 responses and 637 selections)
% of 348 responses
No odor 109 = 31%
The breath 52 = 15%
The muzzle 110 = 32%
The entire head 76 = 22%
The entire body 142 = 41%
Pet Bedding & toys 87 = 25%
Owner’s house & belongings 61 = 18%
Did you change something specifically and noticed that the odor seemed to disappear?
Approx improvement time? Proofed?
1 Added Probiotics Acidophilus weeks Yes
1 Added Probiotics FortiFlora weeks Yes
4 Added B12 Injections weeks No
5 Added B12 Wonderlabs “Trinfac” days/weeks No
1 Added B12 Metagenics “IntrinsiB12” days No
3 Added Anti’s Tylan weeks/months No
1 Added Anti’s Metronidazole weeks No
2 Added Acid Reducer Pepcid AC No
3 Added Supplement Coconut Oil weeks No
1 Added Supplement Salmon Oil No
3 Changed Enzymes EnzyymeDiane (Euro) 6x to EnzymeDiane (USA) 6x
1 Changed Enzymes EPI Pro6 to EnzymeDiane 6x
1 Changed Enzymes EnzymeDiane 6x to EPI Pro6
3 Changed Enzymes Pancrezyme to EnzymeDiane 6x
2 Changed Enzymes Pancrezyme to EPI Pro6
4 Changed Enzymes Viokase to EnzymeDiane 6x
1 Changed Enzymes PartnarHealth to EnzymesDiane 6x
1 Changed Enzymes BioCase V to EnzymeDiane 6x
1 Changed Enzymes Pancrex V to Pancrex Granules
11 Changed Diets Various:
(a) from Prescription food to low fiber food.
(b) from 1 protein to another protein food.
(c) from 1 grain free to another grain free food.
The actual survey form (has since been closed) odor survey
Results were submitted to Dr. David A. Williams May 8, 2013
The actual survey used to conduct this odor survey study:
Dr. David A. Williams, MA VetMB, PhD, Diplomate ACVIM, Diplomate ECVIM, a Professor at the University of Illinois, would like to develop a research project to evaluate what causes the foul odor that develops in some dogs or cats with EPI when they are treated with pancreatic enzymes, and how best this problem can be treated. As a prelude to this work we would like to more precisely characterize the “odor” that some EPI pet owners experiences when EPI treatment commences. Our long term goal is to work with Dr. Williams to identify the cause of this odor and establish effective strategies to eliminate the order.
If “NO“ your EPI pet did not experience any odor…. Thanks for helping us out …… the survey is over for you. (there is one little glitch with this… it will not allow you to submit the survey unless you check “No Odor” in this section… then submit and you are done! )
Where around the dog (or cat) was the odor apparent? Please select all that apply.
Around the muzzle
Around the entire head
Just the breath
Around the entire body
The dog (or cat’s) bedding and other interactive articles
The room/your house /your belongings
No odor
Dr. William’s research will help shed some light