Epi4Dogs

Hello everyone! So I found this article from dogs naturally magazine and wanted everyone's input. I was intrigued when I saw an article on EPI and SIBO in dogs. According to this article, dogs with SIBO need what they call "the correct pre and probiotics" to manage SIBO well. Hmmmmm.....

Here is the quote from the article: " As mentioned earlier, probiotics with Lactobacillus or Bifidobacterium strains will make SIBO worse. That’s because probiotics have to travel through the small intestine to get to the colon (where they belong). And on their way, most probiotics will feed the bacterial overgrowth in the small intestine. That helps SIBO multiply … and compounds the problem. So you might see an increase in your dog’s digestive symptoms … like diarrhea, flatulence, constipation or acid reflux.........Instead, you need to use soil-based probiotics (SBOs) for your dog with SIBO. SBOs are spore-forming bacteria that have a protective outer layer that lets them move safely through the small intestine until they get to the colon. Once in the colon, they’ll get to work supporting beneficial bacteria throughout your dog’s GI tract. Don’t make the mistake of making SIBO worse with the wrong kind of probiotics!"

And here is the article link: https://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/s ... l-options/

Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts about this. I know I've been having a LOT of trouble managing SIBO....it comes and goes...I've tried numerous different types of probiotics to no avail.......and I'm always looking to improve.

whatever you do, PLEASE do not take their articles or anyone's article as gospel... but do your own research by reviewing MULTIPLE research articles ... for one thing, i can blow holes in this statement " As mentioned earlier, probiotics with Lactobacillus or Bifidobacterium strains will make SIBO worse. " because (for example) you CANNOT paint the Lactobaccilllus as one bacteria.... there are hundreds of Lactobacillus strains that ALL do different things and some can create a positive effect on SID (SIBO) for almost a year, where as other Lactobaccillus strains can only make a positive effect for about a week, while some other strains do nothing and while some of the Lactobacillus strains can make things worse! So whoever wrote this article DID NOT represent what they were told (or researched) accurately.....

Unfortunately i have seen this happen a LOT with magazines, and/or news media publishers.... they interview you and then reduce the interview to talking points to fit within so many words and by then what they state is no longer accurate.

If you want to learn about various bacterial strains in dogs...., i highly suggest you read gut flora research by Dr. Jan Suchodolski who is now considered the premier gut flora vet researcher in the USA... we have some of his research here on this website .. but he has so much more that may interest you on his TAMU listing:
https://vetmed.tamu.edu/gilab/staff/dr-jan-suchodolski/
and i know there is at least one (maybe more) that actually lists many, MANY different strains and what they do or can improve or cause problems with.

IAlso.... i am so sorry you are having a tough time with your dog's SID.... i often think SID is so much more difficult to handle than EPI itself!!! So i feel for you.
But the problem is that every dog's gut flora has it's own unique composition... so it is a misconception that all these "one-size-fits-all" probiotics currently on the market is going to work for all dogs...... it is a lot of hit and miss. What we try to share with people here on the forum are those products that "appear" to have the best "batting average" with many of our dogs... but even that is not guaranteed.

This "article" isn't an article at all.

It's an advertisement disguised as an article that uses information overload and scare tactics to drive you to purchase their soil-based probiotic mix. Common online sales marketing tactic for dietary supplements.

"Instead, you need to use soil-based probiotics (SBOs) for your dog with SIBO." And it links you to their online store.

Roger M. Batt is a highly respected senior UK vet. Dogs Naturally magazine has plagiarised badly a paper he presented In 2002. As far as I know, most magazines have sponsored articles to promote products.
Mr Batt mentions pre and probiotics but his treatment suggestion is a months worth of antibiotics.
I don’t know if this link to the original paper works:
https://www.vin.com/apputil/content/def ... id=3846192

Yes!!! Dr. Roger Blatt is highly regarded in the veterinarian community... but learning about SID/SIBO is like peeling an onion... when he wrote that research back in 2002 it was thought that SID/SIBO was a "secondary" condition that may or may not develop in EPI dogs..

More recently, because of better technology and more research they have since discovered that ALL dogs with EPI have SID/SIBO to one degree or another....

it is really fascinating to follow research and advances regarding the gut flora... they are now uncovering so much that they didn't know before and we are now learning that there is so much more we don't know.... yet.

A long time ago, one of the veterinarian researchers taught me that nothing is absolute.... but to always be ready to debunk something you stood by if/when new /better research comes along and disproves the old way of thinking...........

Mike... you are 100% correct.... ALWAYS be careful of articles that then lead you to a product they are selling.

Over the years i have seen many cases where they cite a researcher's finding and tie it to their product as if to claim endorsement.... one must be very careful!

Has anyone used soil based probiotics and had good results?

Debbie--- Have you considered Tylan for SID? I ask because Tucker takes 1/16 teaspoon daily, also Proviable & slippery elm. Occasionally SID flares up, but for the most part he does well on our routine. --- Pam

i tried the soil based probiotics recently on my non-EPI dogs.... and it was a bust..... but then again, every dog is different.